Large Dungeon: Greater Ruins

[The1True]

...just to be clear, you're looking at a medium-quality, low-rez jpg, 1/3 the size of the actual file. I didn't want to share final quality art with the pilfering masses. So, definitely some line-work may have gotten lost. I'll look into the 'muddled' situation, but I definitely prefer the forest beneath the buildings. It was a mess when I had them above. The colour art is for illustration (you can't see the rooms underneath the roofs, you can't clearly see the levels of the buildings and it would be very difficult to show underground levels or passages). For the purposes of dungeon mapping, I intend to go b&w so things are absolutely clear.

[The1True]

Keepin' the Dream Alive!

So this is what I've been doing for the last two weeks...




It's been heavily compressed to fit as an attachment. Not looking for art critique here. Let's look at this from a gaming/usability standpoint. I have no intention of filling these buildings. I will try to keep keyed encounters down to <30. What I am thinking of doing is creating a roster of Treasures, Hazards and Encounters that can be found in the ruins. The longer the players explore, the more they will find. Most of the Treasures and Encounters are finite. There might be a refresh list of Monsters, so once the roster is exhausted the DM can give it a couple of adventure weeks and then let nature (or the factions) fill in the void. The map is intended to fit on an 11x14 (a centerfold or inside cover) and there's a little space to the left or right throw in these tables for ready reference.

I didn't mark it, but the pit in Xb2 is the entrance to the underworld.

I very much welcome Treasure, Hazard and Encounter ideas for this area. Hell, if you can envisage some keyed encounters, that would be super cool as well! I didn't number the rooms; shit was getting crazy and couldn't come up with a non-retarded numbering system. I was kind of thinking of inserting each of the breakdown maps you see around the sides in the body of the text so they could be referred to while reading the room descriptions. I was thinking of doing further numbering, monster and feature placement as well as other helpful map information there.

I'll try to get around to drawing the profile of the rock-tower next and then I'll go back to fleshing out the hex crawl.

Before I forget; shoutout to Grutzi for the favourable review on Age of Dusk. Was that the one with DP's map? In which case the congrats are shared! Go Team!

[DangerousPuhson]

Oct 22, 2019 16:07:49 GMT The1True said:

Keepin' the Dream Alive!
I was kind of thinking of inserting each of the breakdown maps you see around the sides in the body of the text so they could be referred to while reading the room descriptions. I was thinking of doing further numbering, monster and feature placement as well as other helpful map information there.

Can you isolate the outer maps (mainly S W O & X) into individual png files? I'll help key a few.
If others want to key as well, we should probably agree on a font/style for the maps numbering. Does Arial Bold work for everyone? (I think that's what you've used here True, and it's what I've already done with the Seed Vault map).


I've only just gotten some downtime at both work & home, so I'm diving back into GTC-mode right now.

[The1True]

Here's a first shot at the Rocktop Profile. Try as I might, it was impossible to keep it from coming out shaped like an enormous phallic symbol. I think Germany is rubbing off on me. Wrong choice of words... Anyhooo, I guess I could give old Sketchy's tiered tower a try instead if everything is just a little to veiny and throbbing. yeesh. I included the aqueduct that I was proposing for the subterranean river route to Level 2, and coloured in grey the mysterious, organic-sculpted, seashell tower of the Vanished encased in the ancient sandstone. You guys could go nuts in a weird-shaped structure like that with multi-level dungeon levels and hidden sub-levels etc. It's ruined and much of it is caved in/calcified, so there is no requirement to map it all. Really we just need two or three dungeon levels.

Anyway, that's what I'm proposing. I can come back with a more geometric structure as well as an attempt to tone down the outer rock formations if people hate it!



As usual, compressed for public consumption. The steam over on the right is the heat vents vapourizing the waterfall.
Quick edit. I had to scale the grid up. I think they're 20' squares now.

[The1True]

I put together an Obstacles and Features list of things the players will stumble across as they explore the Rocktop. I havn't settled on the mechanics, but basically it's a roster; so as things are found, they're ticked off and eventually run out and are not encountered again. The longer PC's dig through the ruins, the more Features they'll find and the more Obstacles they'll stumble across. At a certain point the Encounters will become depleted and a new roster of tougher creatures will move into the area. Certain creatures are infinite (Stirges and the mostly harmless Treecrabs and Lizards). Eventually, thorough PC's will notice they're not turning up any more treasure and are being hounded by increasingly difficult monsters and hopefully move on. The other thing I want to stress is noise and how it draws encounters; particularly the Jinglemen. The terror of approaching bells should be palpable.

I know, most of these list-items beg description. I'm trying to avoid too much crunch what with my preference for the much-reviled 3.5e, but I'll try to get my ideas down in broad strokes next.

Hopefully this gels with Grutzi's forthcoming encounter system. As usual, I'm prepared to move things around, take things out or throw things in. Maybe too much treasure for the ground level of a dungeon? Too many traps? Maybe another table for what the Encounter is doing when met? etc.


RockTopObstacles-Features.rtf (3.18 KB)

[The1True]

Hopefully people find this an interesting read. I fleshed out the above list with descriptions and some (sorry) 3.5 rules crunch:


RockTopObstacles-Features-Descriptions.rtf (15.7 KB)

Let me know what you think!

[The1True]

Molly Cowbell:

[DangerousPuhson]

Dude that thing is dope! It's Mo exactly as I'd pictured her from your description.

I also approve of your Rocktop writings thus far - admittedly a different approach than I was expecting, though effective and insightful nonetheless. Seems easy to use, and proves interesting to read.

[The1True]

Thanks! I didn't even think about it, but I was reading 'What Ho, Frog Demons!' last week, it must've lead to the very breezy writing voice. We'll probably have to trim it way back in the end.

[The1True]

I tried fiddling around with the Rocktop cross section some more. Given that it's in a pinnacle of rock, I guess it's always going to be doomed to look vaguely phallic no matter what I do. Unfortunately the worst part is the top which is also the part that I can alter the least since I'm trying to cleave to the contours of the Rocktop map. Anyway, I thought it would be cool if the interior Vanished installation had a more stable base and if the spikes of the seashell structure were protruding from the ancient sandstone pillar in places. Once again, if you guys were envisaging a more geometric structure let me know and I'll head back to the drawing board!




I'm starting to think of this place as an enormous, malfunctioning pumping station. If the malfunctioning infrastructure within can be repaired and the Control Room accessed and activated, the flow of water to the Wastes could be changed! Currently, it's going to Arnlaug's Carcass. It offers an interesting moral quandary for the PC's as well as a responsibility to keep the machinery out of the wrong hands! I'm still trying to connect all the dots, but I think where I'm going with this is; though switching the flow of water temporarily imperils Arnlaugs (though the proximity of the lake will support them for quite a while longer...unless you want to make the lake toxic or too salty etc.), if it's switched to Bowmans and the infrastructure there activated, it will benefit the entirety of the Wastes in the long run.
That shouldn't be immediately obvious though. And in the meantime there should be compelling pros and cons to switching the flow to benefit each of the factions. Urgency will be added to this mission as the PC's delve deeper and more and more factions begin to camp out in the area and start mounting their own expeditions and fighting among each other.

[DangerousPuhson]

I like the changes; much easier to differentiate the shell structure from the dungeon proper (maybe two different colors for the two different areas would help too). I'd personally get rid of the grid overlay; it clutters up the map and isn't as useful as, say, a direct measurement listed next to whatever is worth measuring (height of the plateau, length of the aqueduct, depth of Areas X & W, etc.). It also kind of forces us to adhere to exact dungeon sizes that match this particular map, so it's better to just nix the grid on this one and call it an Overview Map rather than a tactical one.

Are we still going with random generation for the shell complex and then a proper map and key for the dungeon complex?

The water flow thing sounds like something from Fallout, which I dig, especially considering our adventure takes place in a blighted wasteland. I think if we are going to put a tipping point into the adventure, then switching the water flow is the natural time to do it - so many chances to earn and lose favor with factions, to alter the contents of a few hexes, and to leave a lasting mark on the wastes.

[The1True]

>>The water flow thing sounds like something from Fallout

Right? That thought's been nagging me all day. Fallout 3 had something to do with water, didn't it? Dammit, how much am I unconsciously ripping it off?

[The1True]

>>Are we still going with random generation for the shell complex and then a proper map and key for the dungeon complex?

I figured the non-essential levels are just ruined, caved in and inaccessible. So you guys can make maps that are not vertically constrained and that have multiple sub-levels and they will still work within the organic structure of the installation. Everything between your levels and Grutzi's could be considered solid, collapsed ruins. You would be hard-pressed to make dungeon maps wider than the dimensions of that surface map I made, but still, maybe pay heed to that small limitation. I guess that's what the grid is for.

I suppose if you're interested in setting up a procedural exploration/encounter/looting mechanic (similar to what I did for the Rocktop ruins) for the non-essential 'lost' levels instead of closing them off, we could do that. It should have it's rewards, but they should be rare and the risks and tedium should be a counter-balance to the activity. But it would definitely give the Factions something to do once they move in. Allowing them to mount expeditions and creating a mini gold rush situation while keeping the narrative-critical levels frustratingly locked away until the PC's can find a way into them...

[DangerousPuhson]

Dec 6, 2019 14:22:45 GMT The1True said:

>>The water flow thing sounds like something from Fallout

Right? That thought's been nagging me all day. Fallout 3 had something to do with water, didn't it? Dammit, how much am I unconsciously ripping it off?

Fallout 3 did have a water thing, but it was all about creating a source of non-radioactive water for everyone - not quite the same, but close enough to be reminiscent. The choice you had to make was basically "free clean water for everyone" or "taint the water with an additive that will kill all the mutants in the wasteland". Nothing about diverting flow or controlling access.

I'm all for abstracting/randomizing the shell dungeon exploration element, based purely on the fact that I think trying to draw up some kind of map for it all would be a monumental headache.

[The1True]

>>I think trying to draw up some kind of map for it all would be a monumental headache.

Definitely. Maybe think of it like S3 'Expedition to the Barrier Peaks'. The finished dungeon levels you guys do are sections of this immense installation. They could be living area, recreational, scientific, spiritual, industrial, or any mixture that gets your creativity going. The other areas are more generic, ruined and pointless to map. There are still treasures to be found and beasts to be fought, but none of it is critical. Your areas would have keyed maps, detailed traps and puzzles, fleshed out NPC/monsters and artifacts, and most importantly items, lore or events that drive the central narrative forward.